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Sheri: I’m very, very excited to have as my very first guest, Marshall Vian Summers, whose latest book, Life in the Universe, was just published. Just to give you a little background on Marshall, Marshall was on a retreat in the desert of the American Southwest and it was there, on a very quiet night, that a voice came to him and instructed him to record.

He began receiving a Revelation from an Angelic Presence that oversees humanity and for 30 years, he recorded the Revelations dubbed “The New Message from God.” I’ve been reading through some of Marshall’s works and to say the least, I am very intrigued and I’m very excited to talk to him tonight and I hope you are too. So with that, welcome, Marshall; I’m so happy to have you as my first guest!

Marshall: Well, thank you so much.

Sheri: So, what would you like to begin with? Would you like to begin with a little more of your story or do you want to launch right into your new book, Life in the Universe?

Marshall: Well, let me say a few things about myself to give you some background. Life in the Universe is part of a greater revelation called The New Message for Humanity or The New Message from God and it speaks about The Greater Community of life in the universe that we’re going to be encountering and are encountering even now.

It is to prepare humanity for a universe that’s far different than our expectations, our fears and our desires. So, it is something very crucial to the future of humanity and I think to the future of all those who have the vision to look out over the horizon to see what is coming for humanity.

Life in the Universe was received—most of the book was received—over a three-day period in 2008. Its publication was delayed because I was in the process of publishing The Great Waves of Change, which is a New Message Teaching on the great change that is coming to the world, within the world. And then I had to deal with some illness difficulties that set me back and delayed the publication of Life in the Universe.

Life in the Universe is a revealed work; it is far greater than anything I could write. It is far bigger than anything I understand. In fact, I’m still studying Life in the Universe. I think it’s a pretty amazing thing to experience, particularly if you read it in a deeper sense, not just looking at words and comparing them with what you believe, but also to really listen to what’s being expressed in these sacred words, because all the books of the New Message come from the spoken word. They’ve been transcribed from the spoken word and the spoken word, I believe, is something that is of tremendous importance at this pivotal time in our history.

So, I went from being a special educator for the blind to being a spiritual teacher, to now being literally a Messenger for this New Message.

Sheri: Much of what you have written about really resonated with me. And I’ve often hoped that there would be someone out there that could put into words the words that I find really difficult, you know, to express, a deeper understanding of what’s going on. So why do you think this information was given to you?

Marshall: Well, I think it was given to me because it is my destiny to be the Messenger for this. It is something that has taken me 40 years to prepare for and to receive. And from the very beginning, The New Message talked about our future in the universe and our contact with other races and how that really had to be understood and it would be much later that the actual Revelation about life in the universe would be given.

But 15 years prior to that, I was given Greater Community Spirituality, one of the books of the New Message, that talks about the theology of religion and spirituality and the universe, the universe that we’re going to encounter and the theological foundation was given then and is expressed, really beautifully, in the two chapters from Life in the Universe called “Creation and Destiny” and “God of the Greater Community.” Those are the two theological chapters in the second part of Life in the Universe.

This is really a Revelation Teaching and I often wondered why it was given to me, but now I can see, looking in hindsight, that my preparation was for this, to be given and to be revealed. And I think when you go on our internet site, www.newmessage.org, you can read about my story and why this was given to me in much more detail.

Sheri: Yes, and I’ve done a lot of reading there over the past few days since I knew you were going to be my first guest and, like I said, it’s really intriguing and I look forward. I have not had a chance yet to read the book, but I’m looking forward to it. How do you believe—how do you think your message about life in the universe can change how we see ourselves in the world and our destiny?

Marshall: Well, Life in the Universe presents us with a non-human universe, not governed by human values, human ethics, human presumptions, human hopes, human fears. It’s a demonstration of nature on a far grander and much more complex scale and that is why preparation for our emergence into this Greater Community of life is so very important, otherwise we will be naïve, we will be foolish or we will be frightened in dealing with it. And we will not be educated about what we’re really going to have to contend with and what life is like and what spirituality means within this vast arena of life.

Sheri: And that’s one of the biggest messages that I got while reading through your work, is this bigger picture that you’ve been given, that we are not alone in the universe and that not all beings that we may encounter eventually have our best interests at heart—but that there are, you call them, the Allies [MVS: uh,hum] that are here to help us, not to intervene and not to make choices for us, but to try and the way I would say it, until I kind of get used to your verbiage is, in a way, trying to help us raise our consciousness.

Marshall: Well, yes, you know, we’re at the threshold, Sheri, of a greater reality that we know nothing about. And of course we project into that reality our hopes and our fears and our dreams and ambitions, but the reality itself is something that we could not know on our own.

Human science cannot reveal it to us. And within our own sphere of understanding of life, which we only understand our human life, we really could not understand The Greater Community and that is why God has given this Revelation to us, and it really did have to come from God.

And the Allies of humanity that you speak of, whose briefings have been a part of my experience to receive, were called by God to give humanity an understanding of the visitation that is occurring in the world today and what we’re going to have to know and do to prepare for our engagement with life beyond our borders and this must come, not from a foreign race. I mean the initial spark of this had to really come from God, because God knows everything that’s going on in the universe; whereas no race could possibly know that.

And even the Allies who’ve come and have given us their briefings, their wisdom, even they don’t know really what’s going on in the universe beyond their sphere of understanding and that is why ultimately, the Revelation has to come from a Divine Source. It cannot be a human creation.

Sheri: Now, when you say “God,” what, how do you interpret God, this Supreme Being?

Marshall: The New Message calls God the God of the Greater Community or the God of all life in the universe. And we’re talking about a universe now, even in our own understanding, [that] is becoming ever greater and more expansive. Let us say that this is a God of a billion, billion, billion races and more, very different from ourselves. And this God is so vast that it becomes very impersonal to us. And yet, at the same time, this is the God that speaks to the deeper Knowledge that each person possesses, waiting to be discovered.

And so God also speaks to us at the most intimate part of ourselves. So the vastness of God and the vastness of creation, which is so beautifully presented in Life in the Universe and in Greater Community Spirituality, is really something that goes beyond our intellectual capabilities entirely. And yet when the engagement with God, which the New Message is very, very focused on establishing through the practice of Steps to Knowledge, for example, happens at the deepest part of us. And it’s that deep engagement that’s beyond our ideas and understanding, beyond the realm and the reach of the intellect, that represents the most powerful force we have within us and the most powerful force in the universe.

Sheri: Hmmm. Wow, well said. So when you talk about God, it sounds to me like you go beyond what many of the world religions would consider God. Kind of a God of wrath and, you know, someone who punishes us if we don’t do what we’re supposed to, or rewards us, or blesses us, if we are good enough, but something that is kind of beyond our comprehension.

Marshall: Yes, you know that’s very important, because I’m using a word here that resonates in different ways for people and has different associations. The New Message Revelation about God portrays God in a non-human specter, but in a very compassionate way as well. And it corrects many of the former ideas that we have about God that have been part of our culture and history and I can highlight some of those, because I think they’re very important for people to consider.

When I use the word “God,” which I do frequently, it’s important to redefine some things, otherwise people think I’m talking about the God of the old testament, or the God of the Vedas, or the God of antiquity, or the God of our training or orientation.

First of all, God redeems the separated through Knowledge and Knowledge is the deeper mind within us. And Knowledge is the key focus of The New Message, because it is at this level that we can truly comprehend who we are, why we’re here, where we need to go, what guides us, what redeems us, what reorganizes our lives.

So while God doesn’t manage the affairs of our daily life, as some people believe, God has put this guiding power within us that exists beyond the realm of the intellect. And this is where our engagement with God really takes place. Not the level of belief or ideology and things like this. And God knows that without this Knowledge, we cannot function successfully in life. We’re prone to error. We’re prone to manipulation. We’re prone to our own fear and grievances. We’re prone to the powerful negative forces that exist around us.

We’re really lost in the world without this guiding compass and focus and navigator called Knowledge. So, because of this, there’s no Judgment Day. There’s really no Hell, except the Hell of separation that we all live within to different degrees. I mean there’s certainly deeper Hells, there’s deeper suffering that we’re capable of, but we’re living in the part of creation called the physical universe and in that state, this is where the separated live. And we’re living in separation.

And when you realize that and can accept that, then you can begin to look for that power or force within you and within others that represents our connection with our Source and with each other that’s so primary that it transcends our biological reality, our history, our nation, our culture, our ideology, all the things that separate us and set us into contention with one another. So I know this is a big thing to take in, but because of the importance of Knowledge, the idea of Heaven and Hell changes entirely. The idea of sin and punishment changes entirely. There is no Judgment Day. And we continue, in life.

And many of the people who will be drawn to Life in the Universe, for example, are people who have within them a connection to life in the universe. They actually have a history of life in the universe living within them, beyond their personal ideas and understanding. And this is a natural orientation and many of these people who have come into this world at this time because the world is in the process of emerging into this larger arena of life. But the traditions of humanity and the religion of humanity is [are?] really isolated to this world alone and it speaks only to the human condition and to the human constitution and does not speak of life in the universe, and cannot prepare us for life in the universe.

And that is why many people have not been able to find their pathway in the traditions of the world which, in themselves, are very valuable. They need a Greater Community understanding and connection. They need to know what spirituality means within a larger sphere of life and this is part of the answer that the New Message presents, is the answer to this need, not only to guide those individuals—and there are many of them in the world today, who have this greater community orientation—but also to prepare humanity for the greatest threshold of all time, which is our emergence into life in the universe.

Sheri: Do you feel that humanity is moving more in that direction now than when you first started this work? Do you feel that more people are awakening to this call and becoming aware of that understanding and that interest in the grander picture?

Marshall: Oh, well I do. I think that we are beginning to respond to The Greater Community reality and science certainly is. I think that The Greater Community is entering into our conversation, our vocabulary. It’s really permeating our understanding and very slowly, but we’re still not prepared for The Greater Community.

I don’t think we’re any more prepared today than we were twenty years ago for the realities and the spirituality of life in the universe. And that is why this part of The New Message teaching on life in the universe was given with such urgency and why I am so passionate about presenting it to people, because it’s going to give us a foundation upon which to approach this larger arena of life and a confirmation of the greater forces within us that has [have?] been leading us to this all along.

Sheri: That’s very exciting. We actually have someone who has a question, so I’m going to bring them on to ask the question. Is that OK? Would you like to take a question then?

Marshall: Yes—oh, yes. That’s fine.

Sheri: Deborah, did you have a question?

Deborah: I did and Marshall, thank you so much for joining. We’re expanding the God Discussion Show. I’m the person who spoke with you last time and…

Marshall: Yes, Deborah, hello.

Deborah: I’m thrilled to have you here and, you know, one of the things you’re talking about right now, the urgency of sort of “waking up’ and, you know, last time we were talking a little bit about how you know, that the natural resources—this is something that we’ve got to address and so in light of the horrible storm on our East Coast last night and yesterday, I’m curious how that fits in with, do you think that this is a wake-up call that people are going to heed? Or are they going to leap into fear mode? And, I’ll just mute myself. Thank you.

Marshall: Well, OK. Thank you for that, and you know, we’re in the foothills of the Great Waves of change now, which means that increasingly, major world events, natural events, climate events are going to be taking place. And this also, you know, joins at a time of our emergence into The Greater Community and they are very connected.

Whether people see this major storm in the East as a wake-up call is, I don’t know, but the New Message prophecy regarding the great waves of change which is presented in the book, The Great Waves of Change, really prepares us psychologically, emotionally and physically, for dealing with a very unstable world, increasing economic and social instability, and the great risk of conflict and war that will be emerging in the years to come over who has access to the remaining resources.

This is all part of the New Message from God prophecy, preparing us for a new world, what’s called a new world. It’s not going to be the old world. A new reality within our world which, along with our emergence into The Greater Community, represents the two greatest events, the two greatest thresholds that human civilization has ever faced. And it’s going to be very big and I wanted to say something about the idea of people waking up.

I think that people become sensitized to larger realities, but if they don’t know what those realities are, or how they’re functioning, then waking up is only a first step. I mean if you don’t know what you’re waking up to and if waking up to a mystery confounds you even more, then it’s going to be harder for people to gain a grasp of the greater forces that are at work in the world today and to be able to appreciate them.

And when I use the words greater forces in the world, I’m not talking about something mystical and inexplicable necessarily; I’m also talking about the forces of nature and I’m talking about the reality of life in the universe, which is a reflection of life on a vast, but very significant scale, for our own understanding. So awakening is but a first step. We also have to become educated about certain realities and we have to prepare and the New Message is really here not only to provide a warning and a Blessing, but also to provide the preparation itself.

Sheri: Excellent. So by studying the New Message from God and Life in the Universe, do you think that it begins giving people the tools they need to do what needs to be done?

Marshall: I do. And you know Life in the Universe, I should mention, is in two parts. The first part deals with the realities of life in our local universe, which I think really gives us a sense that as above, so below, that what we’re dealing with is what we have here on earth but on a vast and complex scale with many, many different participants, non-human participants, but it reflects our life here in the world.

And it gives us a sense of where we’re going, because, Deborah, you mentioned resource depletion and resource depletion is something every advancing race in the universe has to contend with and live with and that is why there is trade and commerce to such a great extent in our local region of space. And we need to know that, because if we want to be a free and self-determined people in this Greater Community, we’re going to have to meet three criteria.

The first criteria is we’re going to have to have a certain degree of unity in our world and this unity will not be brought about by philosophy or ethics, but by sheer necessity, because we’re facing a new world where nations and human civilization itself can falter and fail.

The second criteria is that we have to be very discreet in this universe. Sending all of our radio and television transmissions out into space is incredibly foolish. We have very few friends out there. And so that discretion is what every advancing race must practice in this Greater Community.

And the third criteria is self-sufficiency. If we lose our self-sufficiency, if we cannot provide for ourselves because we’ve depleted and exhausted our own home world, then we’re going to be in a very, very bad situation in terms of other races really taking over here or gaining inordinate power over our future and destiny.

So, this is really a freedom call. It’s not an adventure in consciousness. It is really something very, very big. And the Blessing of is this, for us, is The Power and Presence of Knowledge. And I think the miracle of the New Message itself, coming at this time, when the world is becoming ever darker, more complex, more unstable, where the challenges facing humanity seem to be inordinate and overwhelming.

This is not merely a matter of shift of consciousness. I mean we’re going to have to think and act and live differently in this new world and we’re going to have to reconsider our notions about life in the universe very fundamentally, which I think is very, very healthy, because the New Message presents us with things that are relevant to our experience, not necessarily to our ideas.

And when you read Life in the Universe, the first part of Life in the Universe about the reality, you’ll see that the universe is understandable, even from what we know here on Earth. Much of it is understandable. It’s not an inexplicable mystery that could only confound us. It’s understandable, because it’s a demonstration of the nature and life that we experience here on Earth, but on a vast and complex scale.

Sheri: So, when I look at the things that have been coming up to me, that really allow me to resonate with your work, is when I look around at the division around the world. Especially since we’ve become a real global community in the last decade or so and I see the polarization between greed and altruism, I wonder; what is the difference?

Why are some people driven to be altruistic and greed is the last thing that they think of when they’re choosing a career path or when they’re trying to leave some kind of a mark on the world to leave it better, you know, than they found it when they were born. And then there are those that don’t seem to see the bigger picture; they don’t seem to care about, you know, raping the Earth and polluting our rivers and tearing down all of our rain forests and all for profit.

And they don’t seem to understand that bigger picture. And so it seems like there is just such a huge polarization going on right now between those two factions. You know, you’ve got the radicals on both sides. You’ve got the tree-hugging hippie-like people that are, you know, they’re so into the environment and they’re so into animals, you know, and the sacred, you know, everything is sacred and they fight for that fight and you’ve got the other side that seems to have all the power.

You know, the oil industry and you know, the gas industry, and the financial system—I mean those that have them seem to have the most power on this planet right now are the people who have the least desire to protect it. Do you see it that way?

Marshall: Sure. Oh well, certainly. I mean as we enter a new world, the divisions in humanity will become ever more evident, ever more pronounced and contentious. But without a New Message from God, humanity will not resolve this polarization. In fact, it will continue to deteriorate, breaking down even existing cooperation, as nations become ever more desperate to maintain their stability.

But to answer this on a higher plane, however, God has given all of us the Power of Knowledge, but Knowledge is not very powerful or evident to most people, and so they live for the moment. They live in a world of expediencies; they try to protect what they have, because they’re afraid of losing what they have.

These fears, which we all have, lead to the kind of behaviors that you are describing and ultimately, though, it represents a need for Knowledge, because Knowledge within me cannot be in conflict with Knowledge within you. We may have different ideas; we may argue over how to do things, but we’re in resonance.

But without this Knowledge evident in enough people—and it doesn’t have to be evident in all people—we’re really at the cusp of whether we’re going to build a new future out of chaos or whether we’re going to descend into chaos. And building the new future out of chaos is going to require a new understanding of ourselves, a very grounded view of the world, a very compassionate view of people and an understanding of The Greater Community we live in, whose presence is already in the world, having a dramatic effect here.

So this is a big Calling for people. Because you’re either going to be part of the solution or part of the problem. You’re either going to bail out water or take in water on this big ship called human civilization and this is the time of this Calling; this is the power of this Calling. It has to happen now. We’re actually late. We’re late in responding to this, because things are already in motion and many of these things cannot be stopped. We’re going to be living in a hotter, drier, more difficult world. There’s no stopping that now. There’s only mitigating it and adapting to it.

And it is the power of Knowledge within us that is without fear, without enmity and without judgment or condemnation within us, within you, within each person listening today, that is the power that’s going to make all the difference. And so, when I was receiving the New Message, one of the first things I received was The Steps to Knowledge, was the preparation to engage our surface worldly mind with the deeper mind within us, the mind that’s connected to God.

And that, to me, beyond all of the efforts we might make to correct or mitigate our rising, escalating difficulties, is going to be the key ingredient, the mysterious thing, the thing that changes everything beyond our own understanding. And indeed it’s Knowledge that has led people to begin the spiritual journey.

It is Knowledge that has led people to question the consensus reality. It’s Knowledge that leads people to value greater things, to look beyond the immediate circumstances. And the Calling is for Knowledge now and beyond that, service, because everyone is sent into the world to serve this world in its present circumstances.

So to be angry with the world or judgmental against the world, or enraged by the world, is not really the appropriate response. If you’re here to serve this world, then you have to look for the needs and opportunities that speak to you in a state of service. And Knowledge, for everyone, prepares us for a state of service, because that’s why we’re here.

Sheri: That’s awesome and I think that resonated with me a lot too, because it’s really easy to get caught up in the anger when we see, we think we have this higher vision and then we get angry at people who don’t understand it and who are acting in a way that we feel is possibly damaging and so we get into a judgment part.

So, do the Steps that you talk about help you deal with that, help you release that anger and just kind of be proactive in being, I guess, a positive force for moving forward and doing something, you know, gaining that Knowledge that you talk about, that’s gonna help us?

Marshall: Well, Steps to Knowledge is really the Steps towards engagement with this deeper reality within us. And in this reality there is no judgment and enmity. The Steps to Knowledge teaches us how to use and manage our minds in such a way that our minds work in resonance or harmony with this deeper power, which operates in ways, you know, that we can never really fully understand as long as we’re here on Earth.

I think that, you know, the inner guidance that this is going to require from people, as well as the fundamental understanding of human nature and human civilization is going to be the key thing, because otherwise people will complain but they will not prepare. People will be enraged, but they will not prepare. People will be incensed, but they will not prepare.

What’s important is for people to find their purpose, their people and their place and we can spend some time talking about this, because this is—what does this mean for the person on the ground? What is the criteria for beginning this discovery, because I’m really going to encourage people to enter into the New Message, because it is a new reality.

It will challenge some of your ideas, because it is a New Message from God; it is not a confirmation of we want and believe. But it is giving us that which we are going to need to survive the great waves of change and to build a greater future. God is going to save humanity through Knowledge in the individual, through the Calling of Knowledge in the individual.

This is what has propelled civilization and all the positive ways, through art, through human service, through the development of everything that we benefit from today that is positive and beneficial. It has all come from Knowledge working through the individual, because this is how God works in the world. God works in the world through individuals from the inside out.

And that is what restores and redeems those individuals and that is what brings their gifts into a world of ever escalating need. God will save humanity through Knowledge in the individual. You see, that’s so important, but it requires that everything that I’m saying with you here today—it requires you to really think about these things and not just respond or react because I’m talking about something innate within us.

It’s not something that has to be filtered through you know, our various perspectives, our assumptions, our hopes, our fears and things like that. This is our ground of being for being in the world. One other thing I’d like to say about Knowledge is that Knowledge represents the part of us that never left God, because the separation can never really be fulfilled, because we cannot totally separate from our Source.

So, when I talk about Knowledge, that which guides you, protects you and leads you to a greater life, I’m also talking about ending the separation within us, which is the source of our suffering, our uncertainty, our crisis of being Divine creatures in a cataclysmic world. And the world will become ever more cataclysmic.

But the Calling represents a calling for us to develop our inner connection, and to begin to look through the world with the eyes of Knowledge, which are not the eyes of condemnation. Every great person who has responded to Knowledge has entered a state of service. You don’t escape the world through enlightenment, because even if you achieve the highest possible state in this world, you would still have to come back here to serve.

So we can all serve today and every day. We don’t have to become totally enlightened to do that. We don’t have to spend twenty or thirty years in deep meditation to reach a state of service. We just have to learn how to take The Steps to Knowledge and to follow Knowledge and develop the worldly wisdom we’re going to need so that Knowledge can work through us effectively to serve people down here on the ground, in real world situations.

Sheri: You seem to interchange the words. When you talk about Knowledge, it almost seems like that’s the God we’re talking about. Is this Knowledge that we have, this innate Knowledge within us, do you use, am I way off the mark on that?

Marshall: Oh no. I think this is our God connection and we do experience the movement of Knowledge. That’s our experience of God at this level of existence. Otherwise, God is a huge belief system. And when you live on a belief system, you end up having to defend it against other belief systems and ultimately, this leads you to become an adversary in a world of conflicting ideas and conflicting beliefs and we’re talking about something very different here. So this is your God connection. But, you’re not God…

Sheri: Right.

Marshall: …but you’re part of God. So the part of you that is part of God that is eternal, is what I speak of when I speak of Knowledge. And I use that word and that word is used in the New Message from the beginning to the end, because it represents the ability to experience profound Knowing beyond what our senses and intellect can present to us. This gives us vision and purpose and direction which exceeds what our intellect can provide.

Sheri: Yeah, I think we’ve all probably had that experience at least once in our life where suddenly, we just “knew something.” There was just no doubt. In fact, I always say that it’s when the heart and the head come together, truth speaks. When the heart and the mind are in unison, then truth is revealed and it doesn’t happen all the time, but when it does there is just no doubt about it and it doesn’t require explanation; it doesn’t require anything—it’s just that deep inner knowing where you go “oh, OK, I get that now.”

And as far as the, you know, that we’re not God, but we are part of God. I’ve always thought about that as like a drop in the ocean. A drop of water from the ocean has all the components of the whole ocean. I’ve kind of looked at my connection to God in that same way that I have a drop of that ocean of God within me or I have a ray of sunshine, you know, God’s the sun, and I’m a ray, or I’m a drop of water in this ocean, and that’s kind of how I see it and that’s how we all are connected to this energy that many people call “God.” Is that it?

Marshall: Well, that’s very good and the experience you’re talking about is a profound experience, but it can be a very rare experience and I’m going to talk about Knowledge as something we experience often and one of the first big ways that people experience Knowledge is restraint.

Something’s holding me back from doing something that I would do otherwise. Or something is keeping me from going with this person or taking this action, and that’s a feeling of restraint and you feel it physically. And that is Knowledge at work in your life. Before you have a really big profound “knowing experience,” you’re having lots of little ones on a daily basis.

And Steps to Knowledge brings you into the experience of these. It really connects you with your experience more than your ideas, because within the realm of your experiences are all the evidence of Knowledge influencing you in subtle and sometimes very small ways, but ways that when seen clearly, you know, in hindsight, for example, you can see how this has saved you from things.

I mean we have been saved from calamities we’re not even aware of and will never know about, because of the small persuasions of Knowledge, either gently urging us to do something or pulling us back. And this is not every moment. I mean Knowledge just wants to keep us moving in a certain direction and only if we’re going to really veer off that direction by marrying someone prematurely or by giving our life away; those are the big danger points where this restraint has to come into play, because those decisions will determine the outcome of your life and will preempt you from discovering your greater purpose later on.

And that can produce big Knowledge experiences for people. But if they don’t interpret them, if they don’t listen to them, if they don’t know what they are, if they just, you know, think it’s their fear holding them back, when in fact it’s really Knowledge, then, you know, they won’t pay attention. They won’t understand that something greater is in them trying to keep them focused and moving in a certain direction.

Sheri: Wow. Wow. That’s really awesome and I’ll bet some of the—it’s probably difficult for someone who has been involved in a more of a confined religious structure of belief where they get to get their orders and their—you know, what they’re supposed to believe from someone else and they just follow those rules and they don’t have to do that inner journey.

That journey of going within to listen and learn what those messages are. You know, those messages where that Knowledge is revealed from within. And when that Knowledge is revealed from within and then it’s contrary to what we’ve been taught in some religious system, it can be very confusing. And I think that that may be happening. Do you see that happening?

Marshall: Oh well, certainly, I mean there’s always a battle between Knowledge and the intellect. I mean, Knowledge doesn’t do battle; it just withdraws. But the intellect always wants to control. You know what we think and how we see the world because the intellect is basically based in fear. It has no guaranty of survival; it is threatened by enumerable things; it is overwhelmed by the world. And so it feels it has to control itself and others to remain safe.

And without Knowledge we feel unsafe. I mean we’re going to be fear-based without Knowledge, no matter what we believe in. And a lot of New Age belief is very fear-based. I mean, trying to call the world you know “only the good matters” is fear-based. It’s the unwillingness or inability to deal with the crisis and the tragedy of the world. And people avoid that and seek to live in a kind of idyllic kind of existence, which is not an existence of service and not an existence of Knowledge. And you can use intuition or anything to justify that, but you know, that’s not what’s important.

And I wanted to bring up another thing, if I may, about Knowledge, because this is something that requires kind of an evolving understanding. Steps to Knowledge has 365 steps and as you go through it, it’s going to evolve your experience of Knowledge and your understanding of how Knowledge really works within yourself and within other people. Why is Knowledge so important in the world? If I say, it’s the most important thing there is in life, how can I say that about something that’s so mysterious, something we can’t put our hands on, something that is ineffable?

I say this because everything that happens in the world is a product of decisions that people make, whether they’re leaders of nations or whether they’re people living you know in a slum at the edge of the city. Everything that happens is a product of our decisions. The future of humanity is going to be determined by the sum of those decisions. And what the question is: What then guides those decisions?

And here, you only really have two choices. You have Knowledge guiding those decisions, or you have everything else that masquerades as Knowledge. What does a masquerading Knowledge look like? It looks like intellectual authority. It looks like political power. It looks like all kinds of demonstrations of power. But really the moment of decision with Knowledge is a Holy moment.

It’s an engagement with that which God has given you to guide you, protect you and lead you to building a new life in a world that’s going to be entering increasing crises. And this is how you prepare for the Great Waves of change. This is how you prepare for life in the universe, this, plus gaining basic education about really what is happening.

This Knowledge, then, must guide enough people in human society to be able to shift the direction we’re going. It’s not going to happen in everyone; that’s not realistic. But it has to be guided, a guiding power in those people who are Called to receive it. And this is where your calling is really important, because you’re not called just to be happy or go live a listless life somewhere.

I mean you’re called into service. [Sheri: Right.] You know, God is calling you for a reason and it’s not just to make you happy and peaceful and content. It’s not just to resolve your psychological difficulties. It’s to prepare you to engage in the world in a really proactive and productive way. And this is a big preparation. But that’s where it’s going, because that’s what the world needs. And what the world needs is why we’ve come.

Sheri: Are people resonating with this Message?

Marshall: Amazingly, people are resonating with this Message. I’m calling you, actually, from Indonesia. I’ve been on a tour of Southeast Asia visiting students of the New Message, and I’m in Indonesia at the moment. I’m in Jung Jakarta, Indonesia; I have a little trouble pronouncing that. I’ve been in Korea visiting students there. I was in Malaysia, Kuala Lumpur, visiting students there. I was in Jakarta recently, visiting students there. And yesterday I was in Jakarta and so I’m here to visit those people who are responding.

And, right, we have a Free School of the New Message, which I’m going to ask my son to talk about at the end of our interview. And already we have people from thirty-six countries involved in the Free School, which is free, and you can participate in it to whatever degree you like. But it’s presenting parts of the New Message for people to study together and to share their experiences with one another, which is really exciting. And so, yes, this is taking hold, but it is a message for the whole world.

It’s not a Message for Americans or Europeans alone. It is a Message for people in every society, people who can respond to this calling for Knowledge, people who are having the Knowledge experience already and it’s confounding them and they don’t know what it means. Something mysterious is going on in their life; something is shifting within them.

They’re having a very different experience than the people around them. This is the evidence of Knowledge moving in them and this is what the New Message speaks of, as what religion really means and how it’s going to have to function in the future.

Sheri: Very exciting, do you have a lot of people in the United States that are part of the New Message as well?

Marshall: Well, yes. We have a growing number of people in most of the States in the United States, who are participating through all of the resources that we provide, either online or the gatherings we have several times a year and I’m hoping that in our remaining time that my son, Reed Summers, who’s with me here, can come and talk to your listeners about the resources that we have available for people to study.

Many things are free online. Steps to Knowledge can be studied free online. Life in the Universe is free online as an electronic book. There’s many things for people to explore and study. The New Message is really big. It can’t be concisely defined in a few words, so it does require, you know, some study and to approach it because it talks about so many different things that are so important to our life. So I don’t know how much time we have left here, but I’d like my son to talk about these resources with your listeners.

Sheri: Definitely. I’ll definitely put him on. And also, we can do a new story on God Discussion, too, about your school and get the word out there, too. I’d love to do that.

Marshall: Oh good, yes!

Sheri: Definitely something that needs to get out there more and more, so and also, you know I think we’ve got a little bit of time, so I’m gonna let your son talk and then if there are any questions and if there’s anyone in there that would like to call in and ask a question, the phone number is 914-338-0452. So if you’d like to call in and ask Marshall a question, feel free to call in. OK, so your son is Neal? Is that correct?

Marshall: His name is Reed; I’ll put him online now.

Sheri: OK.

Reed: Hello and thank you all for joining us. This has been a remarkable discussion, a remarkable God Discussion, you could say.

There is a number of also remarkable resources available to people wanting to learn more about the New Message and Marshall. First of all, Life in the Universe is free online if you visit newmessage.org, you will find a free e-book there and I encourage everyone to get into the New Message and begin reading it and exploring these revelations, what they mean for you and for the world.

We, as Marshall said, also have a free school which is a dynamic environment. It’s very exciting; it’s very engaging, with people in over 32 countries around the world participating. And this New Message and this Free School are truly a gift to the world. And that is the intention with which they are given and that is what is happening.

Also at New Message, we have a Forum and weekly News and Inspiration and also a number of events, including an annual Encampment, where people from around the world gather for five days to consider deeply these Revelations about life in the universe, the great waves of change, and the allies of humanity. It’s a remarkable event; I assure you. We just had it in September this year and I invite you to that as well.

And also on newmessage.org, there are numerous free books, audio Revelations. The New Message is over 9,220 pages in length and we are in the process of releasing this Revelation to humanity and so every week more and more is given; the vast library expands; the Messenger speaks.

So this is truly a new reality, online, offline, in the heart, in the mind, between people, that you can participate and become a part of. And also, on the newmessage.org website, you can hear the original Voice of the Revelation as it spoke to The Messenger in the original event of delivery.

If you’ve ever wondered what it’s like hear what the angels were saying to the prophets of old, to the great Messengers of humanity, this is really your chance. And we’re being given the opportunity to be a part of the reception of that Revelation and witnessing and hearing the original spoken Voice. So this is a great opportunity and I invite all the listeners to become involved in that. So thank you!

Marshall: That’s my son, Reed.

Sheri: Oh, thank you very much, Reed.

Marshall: I’m very blessed. My wife and my son are with me and they’ve been with me, you know, through so much of this. You know, I’ve spent 24,25 years receiving the New Message and studying it until it was more complete and so, it’s been a long journey for me; a long, inexplicable journey, to receive this and now, the time has come to proclaim it to the world and to make it available to as many people as possible.

Sheri: That’s very exciting and the way it comes across, it seems much more stable, and I don’t know quite how to put it, it doesn’t lack the credibility that a lot of New Age stuff that you hear nowadays does. It seems to really resonate with a higher truth, with a truth that you know, is important for us to face, so…

Marshall: Well, that’s right and I think that’s such the common experience we’re having from people we hear about who write in everyday and email us that, “I’ve found this; it’s making total sense to me; it’s how I’ve always felt about certain things; it’s making me re-think, you know, things I’ve thought before.”

But the feeling of resonance I think is the power of this and it’s not my power. I mean it is the power of Revelation and it’s the power that’s with this and when you hear the Voice of Revelation and when you read this, there’s something about this that’s very different than anything I’ve found in the world in my many years of early study and it’s a remarkable thing. It’s talking to a deeper part of us, speaking to us as who we really are.

Sheri: I don’t know if you mind me asking this question, but I’m just curious, what kind of spiritual or religious background you grew up in or what you came from?

Marshall: Well, I grew up in an Episcopalian family, which is a very formalized part of Christianity. And then my journey became very mysterious. I was a special ed. teacher for the blind for a time, but I was pulled out of that and I have been following this Voice ever since my mid-twenties and it has been preparing me for something much greater that would occur later in life. So my life has been an inexplicable journey and a challenging journey, but something incredibly rich and rewarding. So everything I tell people, everything I say to people about the miracle of Knowledge is something that I have experienced, as well as the challenge of Knowledge, the challenge to change the way we think and to become inner-directed rather than outer-directed, to follow that which is compassionate and not that which is angry and fearful…

Sheri: Excellent.

Marshall: …and that which is clear and concise and has potency in the world, and not something that’s just a product of our wishful thinking in the face of a threatening world.

Sheri: Excellent. I think we have another caller. Would you like to take another question?

Marshall: Oh, certainly.

Sheri: Ok, alright. Somebody from area code 406 just joined us calling in?

Caller 406: Yeah, hi. My name is Mike from Montana.

Sheri: Hi Mike. Welcome to Dimensions on God Discussion. And what is your question for Marshall?

Mike: Well, I just wanted to make a comment. I want to thank you for having this show. I have personally been a student of the New Message now for over a year and we’re talking about these Steps to Knowledge and I just want to encourage anybody who feels any type of resonance with this Message to check out the Steps to Knowledge. It’s a process by which you take—every day you go through a very simple, often very profound Step and it’s one of those things where the proof is in the pudding.

My life has been so dramatically challenged and changed in so many ways by taking these Steps; I just felt compelled to call in and to thank you but also to testify to the fact that there is something very powerful, very real, very dynamic and very urgently needed and I just wanted to voice that. Thank you for allowing me to do that.

Sheri: Ah, Mike, thank you so much for calling in. It’s always nice to hear from a student of something like this, to hear first-hand knowledge of that. So, I really appreciate your taking the time to call in.

Mike: Thank you.

Sheri: Yes. OK.

Marshall: I always tell people that ultimately the Message is more important than the Messenger and this is a Message that has to resonate far beyond my life to the minds and hearts of people and to give us a way to see our life as it really is and as it is meant to be in a dynamically changing world and where we can look at opportunity and crises in a whole new way and see that our calling is to be here within this time, facing these great thresholds. We’re blessed to be in the world at a moment where humanity is emerging into The Greater Community.

We’re blessed to be in the world at a time when we’re facing a new world and what that could mean for a new reality for humanity, what that will require of people and to be a source of strength for others and a source of clarity and encouragement. I mean that’s what we’re being prepared for and that’s what our hearts really want.

I mean to live in splendor and comfort is empty without that. And that is what Steps to Knowledge is here to prepare you for. And that is why God has spoken again.

Sheri: And thank you so much for offering all this information. It seems to be free online. I mean, what a beautiful gift! Thank you so much for sharing this Knowledge with us. I mean I understand from what I’ve read of your work just how important this really is. And I would really like to have you back sometime, now that I’ve made it through my first show; I was a little nervous. This is the first time I’ve ever done this.

Marshall: You were very good.

Sheri: I would really like to have you back and talk about the Briefings, because that’s what really intrigued me, because you know, I think that there might be some things there. It’s a little deeper knowledge that it might scare people in the beginning, but I think it’s really important. So maybe down the road, would you come back and let me interview you?

Marshall: Oh, I’d be happy to join with you again and I just want to say in response to what you shared, which I think is so valuable is that you know, there’s human knowledge and there’s Knowledge in The Greater Community. And Knowledge in The Greater Community is something that is being presented to us really for the first time, in a very coherent manner and so it’s very exciting and The Allies of Humanity Briefings do demonstrate that Greater Community Knowledge.

Sheri: OK

Marshall: So I’d be happy to come back and we have many, many things to share regarding the Revelation itself.

Sheri: OK. It’s wonderful. I’m really happy that you were able to join us all the way across the world tonight. It’s just been a pleasure talking to you and hearing about your work. I look forward to getting into it even more.

Marshall: Good!

Sheri: Yep. Thank you to everyone who tuned in; looks like you have quite a few people that joined us tonight. Thank you to Reed for sharing with us as well. Thank you, Deborah, for being my backup, because the technical part of this kind of terrified me. So…

Marshall: OK. Well, you did a very good job! And I appreciate you asking really important questions. These are important questions. Sometimes in interviews I don’t get asked important questions.

Sheri: Well I’m glad you didn’t mind me varying from the list.

Marshall: No, it’s fine. I think we’re engaging in really important things that your listeners are interested in and need to hear.

Sheri: Well, thank you again for calling in. What time is it there, by the way?

Marshall: It is about 10 o’clock in the morning.

Sheri: Oh it is? OK. OK, all right.

Marshall: Yes.

Sheri: OK. Well, enjoy your day. Thank you again for being my first guest. And if there are no, let me make sure that there’s nothing that I’ve forgotten. I don’t think so. But once again, thank you everyone who joined us and we will see you the first Tuesday in December.

Thank you again, Marshall.

Marshall: OK, thank you and Blessings.

Recorded: October 30, 2012

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